Dynamic Apnea

[frogmansailor]

Hey guys, just thought I'd share this and see what people had to say.

I've been doing static apnea training for about 6 months now while I'm going to sleep at night. I don't do it every night, but on a somewhat regular basis. On Monday I got to my longest yet- 3min 9 sec

So today since I had off from school (yeah snow!) I thought I would try some dynamic apnea. I hooked my bike up to the trainer and strapped on my polar hrm and did a warm up ride (hr around 120). I then put on my mask (psychological stressor?) and went through my usual breathing routine (in 1 out 1, in 2 out 2, in 3 out 3, as high as I can go) I then tried holding my breath, still keeping the same cadence on the bike.

I only got to around 30 sec. After a few more recoveries and tries my max was 47 sec. and by then end of that my hr was down to 62.

Is this normal to have such a large difference between static and dynamic? Should I practice dynamic more, rather than the static to better my dynamic times?

thanks for the help

-Dave

[alexrom1207]

Anytime your heart rate is up that high expect to cut your times down severely. The long dynamic distances are a result of divers keeping their heart rates down while they are swimming.

[Jee]

Practice in water, of course only with a buddy! That will raise your static time for sure.

Also try the dynamic apnea in pool, swimming (at the bottom, in mask, with fins)

On bike doing a one minute static (dynamic) while biking is not bad at all. This movement is much different than dynamic with fins i.e. In water you can relax more, so you consume less oxygen, even while doing DYF or DNF.

[sanso]

Originally Posted by frogmansailor

... warm up ride (hr around 120). I then put on my mask (psychological stressor?) and went through my usual breathing routine (in 1 out 1, in 2 out 2, in 3 out 3, as high as I can go) I then tried holding my breath, still keeping the same cadence on the bike. ... and by then end of that my hr was down to 62.
...

Could You explain why You train like that? I don't see why you would train Dynamic with a starting heartrate of a 120, as one usually relaxes before Dynamic as well as static.
Also I'm not sure if I understand your breathing routine - are those numbers seconds? And if so, are they the time you take to inhale/exhale or breaks between in- and exhaling?

That your heartrate dropped is a good thing, but You should start at that reate.

[naiad]

Be careful about the bike apnea. It is possible to have a serious accident if you black out, even on a stationary bike.

[frogmansailor]

The reason I'm biking is that I don't have access to a pool, so actually training is out. I am aware that a black out could be dangerous, but I am not too worried: There is a bed to one side of the trainer, and a wall on the other. Falling foreward onto the handlebars will hurt, but then again I don't plan on pushing myself to that limit.

What I meant by the hr thing was that I wanted to find an easy pace on the bike that might simulate heavy finning. I figured if I train at dynamic while doing something as intense as that, relaxing in the water will produce better times. Like training past my goal.

My breathing routine is not really seconds, but probably close. I have a resting HR around 60 and when relaxing for static apnea I always breathed with my hr. one beat in (no pausing) one beat out (no pausing) two beats in, etc. I tried to recreate that while on the bike (obviously I was not breathing with my hr at that time-hyperventilating is bad!).

It was my first attempt at dynamic training, so these comments are welcome. Or if anyone wants to let me have access to a pool.... Philadelphia area... I could actually practice :-)

[Haydn]

Try doing dry 'Pippin' walks.

1. Breath for two minutes.
2. Hold for one minute, then while still breath holding, get up and walk until commencement of contractions.
3. Breath gently as you walk back to the start.
4. Repeat above but walk further, until discomfort.
5. Repeat above but hold for two minutes, get up and walk. Despite the longer breath hold prior to walking, you will walk further again.
6. Repeat step 5. This time walk until the point of colapse. You will crumple to the floor (grass not concrete).
Practice walking fast or slow, but always try to max the distance on the last walk. Time the walks until your walks roughly equal the time your max dynamic apnea takes.
You will get used to how your body feels at the point of blackout and when doing a dynamic you will recognise the signals.

[frogmansailor]

Great idea. Thanks. Once it is a bit warmer (and the snow melts) I'll give it a shot!

[Jee]

Originally Posted by Haydn

Try doing dry 'Pippin' walks.

6. Repeat step 5. This time walk until the point of colapse. You will crumple to the floor (grass not concrete).
Practice walking fast or slow, but always try to max the distance on the last walk. Time the walks until your walks roughly equal the time your max dynamic apnea takes.
You will get used to how your body feels at the point of blackout and when doing a dynamic you will recognise the signals.

I would not recommend you to follow this step. "Until you collapse"... I'm not that very convinced, that collapses in serie are healthy, and also falling on the ground unconsciously several times is not the best plan, even if it is grass. Just imagine, that your wrist happen to get under your body in a unlucky position, when you hit the ground. It can result in injury, imho.

Though recognizing the signals of a coming blackout is useful for sure.

[sanso]

Consciously walking into a BO isn't very smart, really. Better skip that one.

[frogmansailor]

Ok, so maybe I won't do that. Haha.

[Haydn]

Let me correct the collapse part. You wont make it that far. Every time I try to do the walk, I always go to the max yet have never yet been able to black out. I always stop, able maybe to do a couple more steps but choose instead to make a controlled descent to the floor, just by dropping to my knees and rolling over. Its easier to do that than it is to simply bend over and rest your hands on your kness, while you get your breath back, by doing that you still have to retain your balance. Its much better to lay in a crumpled heap and just breath. If you find it easy to stand after the last walk, you simply havent gone far enough. You must feel wobbly and weak kneed and compelled to stop.......but you dont stop until you haver gone further than last time.....maybe you increase the speed, maybe you go slower and increase the time you have to get there.....but you must not stop by choice, only by compulsion. Remember to walk to the point of collapse, not actually collapsing. You can control your descent to the ground. Now is a good time.....the ground is soft.

[cdavis]

Interesting,

That is just what I felt like; it was time to sit down, RIGHT NOW. Weak kneed and shaky thereafter. I got away from that kind of practice because I thought it likely that I would BO and fall on my face pretty soon. Maybe I should try again.

Connor

[Haydn]

Remember the purpose of the walk is not to see how long you can hold your breath, but to recognise certain signals and how you can increase the distance covered by either walking fast, slow, or speeding up near the end. Thats the whole deal of dynamic walking, experimenting with your pace. The walk allows you to get it wrong....you fall over. Or get it right, you drop to your knees and recover. Remember also to practise the protocols. Sometimes you just give up early, and that is the easiest way to fail in covering any important distance you are competing for.

[flying_spanner]

Originally Posted by Haydn

Try doing dry 'Pippin' walks.

1. Breath for two minutes.
2. Hold for one minute, then while still breath holding, get up and walk until commencement of contractions.

I don't get any real contractions while doing statics or dynamics. I may try this later to see how it feels.