Omer Cayman HF 100

[covert]

lol spaghetti seatech is so euro ive never even heard of them, but its probably very opinioinated I shot with some picasso's and other and some other euro guns and i dont find them rugged or acurate enough for our local conditions. though you could send me a seatec to demo and ill let you know the comparison :P

[spaghetti]

Originally Posted by covert

lol spaghetti seatech is so euro ive never even heard of them, but its probably very opinioinated I shot with some picasso's and other and some other euro guns and i dont find them rugged or acurate enough for our local conditions. though you could send me a seatec to demo and ill let you know the comparison :P

Believe me I did'nt intend to hit your national pride: South African guns are given a very high valure all over the world (especially in the Usa and in general in the ocean nations) so no doubt they are fantastic. But It must be true there's a right gun for every kind of fishing, fish and environment. It just seems widely accepted that european guns are better for Europe, while guns made in ocean countries like yours are better for hunting in the ocean. Or so it seems...
Gun exchange between you and me? Yes why not. But for the above mentioned reason, then you must move to live in Italy, and I must move to SA (and make friends of the GWS....no no no! )

[covert]

awww cmon spaghetti ill first warm you up by meeting some raggie's and once your use to petting them and feeding them by hand. Ill introduce you to a couple of very friendly GWS (they always smile at me when they swim past) e&oe terms and conditions apply, covert does in no way shape or form accept legal liability for anything that might happen to spaghetti during his stay in SA.

And no its not a national pride thing. I think its just that we hardly ever shoot any fish under 2kg's down here. So we get use to our equipment. Like I said im a bit out of my depth in this convo since most europians have a combo of euro + Rabi/RA and most of us down here only have Rabi's and RA's. Who knows maybe ill sneak in a weeks vaction to itally then you can show me first hand what your seatech's can do.

[strangelove]

Spaghetti,

I think is a wise choice to have all guns from the same brand, on my last trip to Brazil we normally started the day fishing inside a bay where the water was very murky so the gun of choice was the black viper 75 as we progress moving out of the bay the water would improve so I would change the gun, sporasub 90 , sporasub 100 at last I've picked my yokooji (it has a Alexander trigger). That trigger feels so different then the sporasub that I've actually lost a couple of groupers (I've squeeze the trigger with the same effort as I was doing on the sporasubs - but force was not enough to fire gun, the hesitation was long enough that the fish moved).
It seems that omer has put a lot of work on the HF trigger, so if you plan no changing guns on the same day from your seatec to the HF, you may find it awkward for the first shot, just like I did going from the sporasub to the yokooji. Some thing else to keep it mind.

What is your fin situation these days ?

[marindiver]

It seems to me that you Adon and me, have similar problem with our guns. I was also getting the cramps in my hand after some time hunting with may Gabbiano. Although the Gabb. is a great gun, somehow I could not get used to its handle. This is the main reason I am in the quest for a new gun, and hf of all guns I hold in my hand have the most comfortable handle for me.
Ones again we opened the everlasting question - which setup is better : one powerfull band, or two smaller. I agree with you Adon that with two bands you gain in flexibility, but on the other hand there is a set back in tracking.
My Gabbiano has old trb muzzle, that means only one pair of bands - 20mm.
For diferent kinds of hunting I use diferent shafts : for smaller fast fishes I take 6,35mm, it has superb speed in first 2-2,5 meters which is ok for golden gray mullets, oratas and even for smaller bass. When I need a longer range and good penetration ( amberjacks ettc. ) even on the end of effective range I use 6,5 or 6,75 mm( trygons ) shaft. So you see, same goal can be achived with a number of diferent strategies.
I am sorry, Spaghetti, that I misspell your nickname last time, its my bad english.
I was a bit dissapointed when saw Gabb. Snake - they change only the muzzle and yet, put a higher price. Gabbiano is a very good speargun in so manny ways, but I think it is time for more serios renewall. Handle should have better ergonomy and be placed higher towards barrel - better shooting when you don`t have time for aiming and also better control of recoil. Trigger mech can be moved further back to increase effective lenght of the gun ( lenght of streched bands ) while owerall lenght stay the same - like on Trygons dmr.
I am sure that Seatec team will come up with some great new ideas soon, but looking at the commpetition, they should hurry.
So I´m still in dilema - wait for new Seatec gun next season or take hf. To be honest, with no many issue my choice will be c4 Mr Carbon, but that is way too much many for me.
However, maybe we are all too much focused on equipment. Sometimes when I see us all debating on every litle detail of equipment with so much passion,energy and spent time, I think of spearos 30 or 40 years ago - they din`t have as near advanced equipment as we have today. Were they catching less fish then we do ? Don`t think so.

All the best to you all.
Marin

[covert]

lol marinediver you make a good point but on the other hand if i remember the fish i use to catch only 15 years ago I wouldnt need accuracy, they were monsters!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Unfortuanitly the fish nowadays are much less in abundance and much smaller in size. But yeah i have a tuna gun that my dad used when i was a kid. A big ol lumpy double handle wooden peace of "natural history" but hey it makes easy work of going through a tuna

[Meshari]

i think 110 is a small siza

and my bad experience with t20 handle make dought the new HF handle


i think the new beuchat marlin is the best nowadays

[badlander]

Had to chance to feel the hf 90 in the water and compare it to my Gabbiano 90 this morning.My mates just got it 'as it came' and though it's very light,the muzzle is way too light so i suggested adding some of the weights to get it more balanced,then i reckon it'd be a nice weapon,but,i still prefered the feel of my gabbiano,heavy sure but lovley and smooth and i just love the handle size and shape.I'd buy the hf 75 though as an additional gun because properly set up there's no denying it's quality.

[spaghetti]

As you see my friends it's mostly personal preference: Marindiver doesn't feel comfortable woth the Seatec handle, while Badlander loves it. Meshari had bad experience with T20, while I am okay with them. And so on, and so on.
But what kills me is that all european gunmakers are running towards the same direction: in a couple of years the classic french style arbalete will disappear, and all newly designed spearguns will look the same, being the only difference in the quality of materials, the stiffnes of barrells, the strentgh of trigger, but still all in the same design.
Actually, almost all the last two or three years new european guns show the same features:
-a handle similar to the C4 Monoscocca (Pathos, Effesub, X-Fire, Thunder, Cayman: all the same concept)
-a barrell that is a mix of old Omer master and SA raiguns (bigger mass and full length rail)
-A Totem style muzzle (which means: no muzzle, just a couple of holes for circular bands and two hooks to fit the line loop).
This standardization does not necessarily mean a technical improvement: it just means to me tha gun builders are following a fashion, just running behind a standardized taste of a globalized market. Let's see some examples of recently designed handles:
--C4 Monoscocca (the reference point)

---
effesub:

---
Cayman

----------
Pathos

---------
X-Fire

-------
Thunder

---
As you see they all look the same. Comments...?

[mundial]

Originally Posted by spaghetti

Covert: never tried Rabi or RA (they're not available in my country). But I asked an opinion to Dave of Spearo Uk, who sells both Rabi and Seatec in his shop, and he said that Seatec is better for spearfishing in Europe (i.e. for european fish)

Believe me I did'nt intend to hit your national pride: South African guns are given a very high valure all over the world (especially in the Usa and in general in the ocean nations) so no doubt they are fantastic. But It must be true there's a right gun for every kind of fishing, fish and environment. It just seems widely accepted that european guns are better for Europe, while guns made in ocean countries like yours are better for hunting in the ocean. Or so it seems...
Gun exchange between you and me?

RA & RABI are most popular in Australia & Newziland also
in israel also RA are popular for those who dive deep but
wooden guns also
i bealive Marwan in Eygipt uses a rabi also
everyone with his way of hunting & feeling for guns
I must say i am sad for U about the stollen XXV gun
hope U get another one

[marindiver]

As for the handles, they should look similar – they all are designed for human hand. And also thunder is just a budget version of x-fire,while effesub is italian maker of pathos ( with small differences ). It´s nice to see though that some manufacturers recognize importance of ergonomics and the fact that with possibility of even minor adjustments by the buyer, handle ca be used by manny people with diferent hand sizes. ( c4 Mr Carbon, Cressi Geronimo, and even OMER HF )
One must not overlook the fact that mentioned guns in this thread are product of higly comerciolized industry, big, inerted, proffit hungry, companies ( with few exeptions )
which are compeeting on global market and must follow it´s rules. When don´t have new ideas for improving product they borrough some from others, recycle old features presenting them as new, also make a few make up changes, put higher price, start a commercial campain and buyers are happy, convinced that finaly they found a perfect gun for themselves ( the moast of average informed aniway ) – and so on every season. Am I mistaken or Cressi Geronimo have very similar muzzle and bands sistem to OMER xxv gold ?
Remember, a number of years back, when they started to use carbon for barrels in order to minimize bending ? After a while, every company had at least one carbon model, the fact that most of carbon made barrels bended just as allu ones did not bodder them – they were selling. Ofcourse, we consumers contribute a lot – we were buying. People were investing in new spearguns even though old ones they have serve very well to them.
For the french typ arballete, yes in a while it will be very rare in production, but don´t worry, when market gets bored of this new design, and buyers be screeming for something new, most likely we will see glorius return of it´s classic design.
I don´t know if any of this make sence to anyone, but I tried to express my opinion as good as my english lets me.

Best to you all.
Marin


PS Everybody is complaining on hf that its maximum size is too short. Maybe its barrel making technology allows only this maximum lenght for obtaining the proclaimed bending factor.

[Marwan]

Originally Posted by mundial

i bealive Marwan in Eygipt uses a rabi also

come to think of it i use all kinds...cressi, omer, rabitech, riffe, c4, mamba and Mares...im sort of a collector of cool stuff
my favourte is the c4 of course then comes the Omer...they are both 100 guns... the rest besides my comanche 90 i dont use as often.... i got the rabi 120 for the deep sea trips where you are likely to see big fish, but i dont go on these a lot ...

[Mr. X]

Originally Posted by spaghetti

...Covert: never tried Rabi or RA (they're not available in my country). But I asked an opinion to Dave of Spearo Uk, who sells both Rabi and Seatec in his shop, and he said that Seatec is better for spearfishing in Europe (i.e. for european fish)

Of course, he might just have a big pile of Gabiannos out back! Just kidding Dave I think he also used to carry RA & C4. I quite like the look of the Seatec myself -- some of the Cornish spearos have them & rave about them.
(What do you think would be a good speargun around 70cm?)

[covert]

Originally Posted by spaghetti

Covert: never tried Rabi or RA (they're not available in my country). But I asked an opinion to Dave of Spearo Uk, who sells both Rabi and Seatec in his shop, and he said that Seatec is better for spearfishing in Europe (i.e. for european fish)

Like i said im biast lol

[Mr. X]

Originally Posted by badlander

Had to chance to feel the hf 90 in the water and compare it to my Gabbiano 90 this morning.My mates just got it 'as it came' and though it's very light,the muzzle is way too light so i suggested adding some of the weights to get it more balanced,then i reckon it'd be a nice weapon,but,i still preferred the feel of my gabbiano,heavy sure but lovley and smooth and i just love the handle size and shape.I'd buy the hf 75 though as an additional gun because properly set up there's no denying it's quality.

I find my guns muzzle heavy, so a lighter muzzle sounds like a good thing to me - although I guess its a question of degree. Wouldn't want to drop it & find the loaded gun pointing up at me. I suspect a light muzzle is one of the key advantages of the HF/HF2 design, as the barrels are not slim. Either way, I imagine it would take some getting used to.

Originally Posted by Mr. X

(What do you think would be a good speargun around 70cm?)

I'll answer my own question: the Omer XXV 75cm is a superbly agile gun around 70cm. Yes it's a tad longer than 70cm but its also unusually light and slim (25mm barrel, super-slim handle) with a slim spear (6.3mm) that is 5cm shorter than usual; it probably handles sigificantly better than many/most 70cm guns. I don't anticipate needing anything smaller than this (I now wonder if the 82cm model might have been agile enough to be my small/"Dorset"/poor viz/pier gun!).

Any more news on the new Omer pneumatic gun? Anybody used one of the "reverse trigger mech" speargun designs care to comment/review it - I'm curious to find out if really are more powerfu/ harder to load/etc. or pretty much the same as a normal gun).