Free Diving Schools

[diveoceanos]

Can any1 send me the course outline for freediving courses from level 1 2 and 3 and maybe 4? I just need the headings of the subjects being taught in every level.

[island_sands]

Originally Posted by diveoceanos

Can any1 send me the course outline for freediving courses from level 1 2 and 3 and maybe 4? I just need the headings of the subjects being taught in every level.

For which agency? I paid to be an instructor and trained hard. I wouldnt part with my $$$ so easily

[samdive]

my thoughts exactly

if you want this information - become an instructor!

[diveoceanos]

Originally Posted by samdive

my thoughts exactly

if you want this information - become an instructor!

This is much different than many SCUBA diving organisations. You may find the course outlines available on the net very easily. I am a course director for NAUI, an MSDT for PADI, and a technical instructor for TDI. If I describe what it will be taught during a course does that mean that the receiver of the information will take my job? You can't be serious!

The course outlines is not the detailed information but is just a list of the subjects that are being taught during the course. In my opinion every student has the right to have this information before he starts.

I can not understand this mysticism pals!

[island_sands]

Originally Posted by diveoceanos

This is much different than many SCUBA diving organisations. You may find the course outlines available on the net very easily. I am a course director for NAUI, an MSDT for PADI, and a technical instructor for TDI. If I describe what it will be taught during a course does that mean that the receiver of the information will take my job? You can't be serious!

The course outlines is not the detailed information but is just a list of the subjects that are being taught during the course. In my opinion every student has the right to have this information before he starts.

I can not understand this mysticism pals!

Whether you are a course director all of those agencies, it doesnt matter, and no-one here wants your job, i promise.

When you became an MSDT for PADI, how did you get hold of your course outlines? Did you buy them, or pilfer them from the internet?

You are right, the student has a right to know, but the instructor pays to have that information. If there is anyone here willing to copy and paste from their instructor manuals let them go ahead.

[island_sands]

http://forums.deeperblue.net/freediv...tml#post659552

PS: If you are actually writing a course outline then what you are really asking for is to see what other agencies are doing and use that. Not really original, is it?

[diveoceanos]

Originally Posted by island_sands

Whether you are a course director all of those agencies, it doesnt matter, and no-one here wants your job, i promise.

When you became an MSDT for PADI, how did you get hold of your course outlines? Did you buy them, or pilfer them from the internet?

You are right, the student has a right to know, but the instructor pays to have that information. If there is anyone here willing to copy and paste from their instructor manuals let them go ahead.

Message received and understood perfectly OK. maybe I wasn't clear enough. Headings means headings not a copy / paste from any instructor manual. Just to give you an idea on what I am interested to have. You may see even the skills that are included in a PADI Open Water Course in the following link. Why have the Free diving Instructors to be a closed book?

Here is a random link that you can get in 0,2 seconds with a little bit of googling

http://www.divewerkz.com/docs/co_openwater.pdf

Is that classified information?

[diveoceanos]

Originally Posted by island_sands

http://forums.deeperblue.net/freediv...tml#post659552

PS: If you are actually writing a course outline then what you are really asking for is to see what other agencies are doing and use that. Not really original, is it?

Is there any reason why not to see what other agencies are doing when you are writing a course outline? It is called market research. Do you really think that the only source of information is behind a closed door of any agency? It sounds like the medicine of medieval ages when a doctor was teaching an other doctor. Today we live in the era of information sharing... i think.

[samdive]

you can see a rough idea of what's in the AIDA courses on my course website

Freedive Training with SaltFree

but if you want to teach any of it, I'd recommend becoming an AIDA Instructor

[diveoceanos]

Originally Posted by samdive

you can see a rough idea of what's in the AIDA courses on my course website

Freedive Training with SaltFree

but if you want to teach any of it, I'd recommend becoming an AIDA Instructor

Sam Thank you, really appreciated.

I am not intenting to become a free diving instructor. I was just been asked to write a course outline.

*** Respect ***

[harbour seal]

Originally Posted by diveoceanos

Sam Thank you, really appreciated.

I am not intenting to become a free diving instructor. I was just been asked to write a course outline.

*** Respect ***

hello dive oceanos,

this whole thread strikes me as rather dubious.

course outlines are generally written by highly trained people, often those who train other instructors will be the ones to write course materials.

how is it that you are writing course outlines if you are not even an instructor? how will you know the approach of the actual instructors or even what they are qualified to teach? if i were one of your prospective students, i would be very concerned to learn that you cobbled together your course materials from reading the internet.

additionally, do you think that kirk and mandy from PFI or Martin from FIT will send you their course materials, without taking the course? likely, no.

just my 2 cents.

cheers,
sean

[diveoceanos]

Originally Posted by harbour seal

hello dive oceanos,

this whole thread strikes me as rather dubious.

course outlines are generally written by highly trained people, often those who train other instructors will be the ones to write course materials.

how is it that you are writing course outlines if you are not even an instructor? how will you know the approach of the actual instructors or even what they are qualified to teach? if i were one of your prospective students, i would be very concerned to learn that you cobbled together your course materials from reading the internet.

additionally, do you think that kirk and mandy from PFI or Martin from FIT will send you their course materials, without taking the course? likely, no.

just my 2 cents.

cheers,
sean

Hello Sean,

I aknowledge your scepticism. It is probably derived by a concept of seen the free diving training up till now as it was medicine in the medieval ages, as I wrote above. Today, the proper course outlines are being developed by a team of people. Scientific approach is needed, experience is needed and know how is needed. I have no doubt that the courses that are being taught are highly scientific, sound in their teaching methodology and highly rewarding for the student. Alas, we want to have our own version with our own approach. This project is a team work and there are members of the team that are free diving instructors and highly experienced free divers. Their experiences start back in the 70s where the most of us were infants or not borned yet.

Then, why it is I who have been proposed to lead the writing of the course outline then? As you stated above the course outlines are being written by the ones who train the instructors. I am a course director and an exerienced diving educator for many years now. Now what is a course director? He is the one who trains instructors. Why me and not any one other course director? Apparently because my knowledge about human physiology goes beyond the one of the average course director (university background in relative subject, further education and training with a number of pharmaceutical companies for about 9 years, individual daily study with an accumulated study time of more than 10000 hours in relative subjects, and an active SCUBA diving professional). I consider my self as not one without any relationship with diving related training. I am doing this for 7 years as a professional. I have trained instructors and technical divers among others. An other reason is because I know how to write a course outline according to the agency standards. As for the internet, yes it is being used as a tool for market research. Back in the early 90s i remeber that we were spending hours in the university library searching for bibliographic references through medline which was available in compact disks. Today the same function is availalbe through internet from your home, any time you want it. Who does not using it today to get information on anything? Do you really think that all courses that are out there are inventing the wheel from scratch? Do you really think that all instructors invented the diving physics, or wrote a book about human physiology? This is science. You basically use previous experience and observation to go ahead. You are not wasting any time inventing something that has been allready invented. And of course you add your 2 cents by doing a little bit of original research and include that in the new version of the course.

Education in all areas, no matter what the subject is, either recreational SCUBA diving, or Free diving, or Technical diving, shares common elements and should be based in more or the less the same basic principles. The individual touch of the members who are involved in free diving will contribute to the development of a scientific, challenging and rewarding course.

[samdive]

The courses have already been developed - I wrote most of them initially (I am a PADI Course Director and an AIDA Instructor Trainer) and since then, they have been developed further by a team of the most experienced AIDA Instructors

The system already exists. If you want to use it, I suggest you become an AIDA Instructor. Why re-invent the wheel?

[harbour seal]

hello diveoceanos,

damn, you beat me to it.

after some reflection i was about to mollify my previous post given i really did not have much information on which to form such a strong opinion (note to self: next time questions first); however, you just responded so i instead i will write here.

the "dubious" lack of training/knowledge i envisioned is seemingly incorrect as you illustrated (although your expertise clearly lies with scuba). my apology for jumping the gun. in the future i will attempt to keep my generalized skepticism and sardonic nature at bay , at least until i have all the facts (then look out ).

i think that sam makes an excellent point here, perhaps you could illuminate us as to your motivation:
"The system already exists. If you want to use it, I suggest you become an AIDA Instructor. Why re-invent the wheel?"

on a lighter note, i have indeed enjoyed some of your previous posts where you have shared your knowledge of diving physiology. this one comes to mind where you posted the nitrogen tables for freediving http://forums.deeperblue.net/safety/...rapping-2.html

good luck with your program and keep us informed as to your progress.

cheers,
sean
vancouver, canada

[Stavros]

Dear diveoceanos,
You say:
"Apparently because my knowledge about human physiology goes beyond the one of the average course director (university background in relative subject, further education and training with a number of pharmaceutical companies for about 9 years, individual daily study with an accumulated study time of more than 10000 hours in relative subjects, and an active SCUBA diving professional). I consider my self as not one without any relationship with diving related training. I am doing this for 7 years as a professional. I have trained instructors and technical divers among others. An other reason is because I know how to write a course outline according to the agency standards.
"

So you are qualified to write a FREEDIVING course manual???

Nowhere in your qualifications do you mention anything about you actually being involved in freediving... (and sorry but the only similarity scuba diving and tech diving share with freediving is that they take place in the water - apart from that point most things are not that similar)

And to make matters simple ... when you decided to get involved with scuba diving (professionally) did you get together with a few friends with similar interests and start your own organisation or did you become part of an existing diving organisation???

From your qualifications it is obvious you did the later.

My humble opinion is that you should follow the same approach with freediving ...

http://www.hotweb.se/aspportal1/code...ryID=4&actID=3

Cheers Stavros (Kastrinakis)