heavy earproblems

[glassfish]

Hello out there,

Since several years I got ear infections,when I was diving in tropical waters.
So this year I thought to be very clever and cleaned my ears almost every day
with a mixture of about 50% water,25% vinegar and 25% alcohol.But I got heavy infections again and the doc here in Indonesia told me that this stuff is
too heavy to take it many times.(I had to take antibiotics already three times
in about four months now).So I stopped this and cleaned the ears only with bottled drinking water but got this bloody infections again and again.
So what can I do to prevent this???
I have to say that I go down about 10-12 meters when I am snorkeling.
Thanks for any advise.

Axel,the glassfish

[Adrian]

Hi Axel,
I had the same problem as you when younger. Check out this link for the mixture I use:
http://forums.deeperblue.net/showthr...ric#post525143

I don't use 90% alcohol, that is too strong and after a while can irritate the ears, and also I only leave the solution in my ears just a couple of seconds, after which I tip my head to clear the solution from the ear. I also do it just after every dive session when I get out of the water. If you do it only "sometimes" after diving and water stays in the ear canals, the flesh gets soft which is what allows bacteria to grow and the infections start.

You might find the boric acid/alcohol solution is easier on the ears than what you were using, but be careful and do check with your doctor. One thing is important, to make sure your ear is completely healed before going back in the water, otherwise you may just start the cycle all over again.

Hope this helps,
Adrian

[samdive]

You might want to try a pro-ear mask

I didn't get on with it but I know a few people who swear by them

http://www.simplyscuba.com/ProductDe...?StockID=80229

[turtle]

I've had similiar recurrent problems with my ears. I now have a routine which seems to work and prevents any problems. I use vented Doc's proplugs (you have to fit them for an exact size though otherwise they're useless) and before placing them in the ears, I fill each ear with mineral water. After the dives I carefully dry each ear out with the edge of a towel, and if there is any irritation I use a product called Otosporin, which I'm told is also suitable for occasional use such as postdiving. Be careful of what ear drops you use though because in case of a perforation, getting the wrong stuff in your inner ear can lead to permanent deafness! Also visit a specialist doctor who can test your eardrums to see if they're consistently weakened, and can (probably necessary) remove any debris from the ear canal and scrape away infected or dead tissue. It costs a lot, but is worth it. I've also been recommended to limit using olive oil to once a week.

Also worth looking at are the 'eustachian gymnastics' suggested by Pellizzari and the Nice divers.

Besides that, just take good care of your ears, by which I mean wearing a beanie or something if it's windy after diving, if you have a 'sticky' ear, don't dive through it, don't sleep that side down at night, if you have stuffy sinuses don't try to dive through it, don't blow your nose like crazy if you have a cold, that sort of thing - common sense!

Anyway, I hope this helps a little, I know how much trouble ears can cause!

best,

fred

[spaghetti]

My contribution to this discussion is that my ears are really f....d up.
I have a date with a doctor in september, he's a specialist in underwater related pathologies: on the telephone I told him my symptoms, anamnesy and familiarity, and he said it's not going to be a simple case. I have chronic sinusite, nose bone curved, 20 years of dive related eardrum injuries and ...genetic familiarity! (my mother had a sort of eardrum surgery: they took a leaf of skin from her neck, and made a sort of new eardrums with it!). So what's the end of it?
BUT I STILL DIVE EVERY GOD SENT DAY!

[trullalla]

hi spaghetti!
so...you have a date with a "he" doctor....
this is how you fix your ear problems...

sorry! just kidding!!

[spaghetti]

Originally Posted by trullalla

hi spaghetti!
so...you have a date with a "he" doctor....
this is how you fix your ear problems...

sorry! just kidding!!

The truth about my ear problem? Yes, I am an "orecchione", or "ricchione" (translate this, Linda!).

--seriously, I'm appreciating any tips to come from this thread. What I was trying to say in the upper post, is that no pain or injury can take diving away from me. And I think this is true as well for all of you fanatics out there. Best wishes for full recovery to all of you "ricchioni".

[Doc]

There are a few issues by the look of it
1. Otitis Externa or swimmers ear where the wax and debris gets saturated forming a wet mush which bacteria love to live and breed in. More common in hotter climes.
prevention is to keep them clean and dry but never stick anything in like cotton buds etc as the end falls off or it just compacts the wax.
Olive oil softens the wax and proofs it so a couple of drops weekly shold be enough. For smelly painful ears try a little vinegar but if no goog after 24hours see a doc for antibiotic drops. If the debris is overwhelming the ENT guys have a cool micro hoover to give them a good suck out.
Ear plugs are ok for swimming pools but not for diving as they get driven in. I suggest either silicone putty moulded plugs fitted you own ears or a cheap version is cotton wool and vaseline mixed then place in the ear.
Occasionally a small bony spur forms in the ear canal called an oseto chondroma it can be left but gets in the way. usually waterpolo players. kayakers and windsurfers get these ? impact related
2 otitis Media which is rel to the inner ear. that is the one where youve dived with a cold and cleared ears pushing the snot into the middle ear. usually need oral antibiotics
Hope this helps.
The experts are probably the aussies who I hear are now genetically selecting webbed feet!!!

[naiad]

Originally Posted by spaghetti

What I was trying to say in the upper post, is that no pain or injury can take diving away from me.

Same with me.

I used to sometimes get outer ear infections, but now it doesn't happen any more. Maybe I have built up immunity. Otosporin clears them up quickly.

For middle ear infections, learning to equalise and open the Eustachian tubes has made a big difference for me. Now I hardly ever get them, and before I started diving they were a big problem.

Lucia

[Evita]

Hi all,

I am watching this one closely, because I think I am getting swimmers ear

This is something I have experienced before. At one time, when I was diving a lot and had trouble equalizing (mostly just one ear - why is that?), I became very desperate and willing to try anything...

Smoking it out.jpg

This time it is maybe owed to too much time spent in pool water. Warm and loaded with bacteria. So I am looking forward to going into real water soon, but maybe the ears won't let me go very deep...

What is the advice on dripping-oil-in-the-ear? Any particular oil? Before or/and after going in the water? Every time or only once a week?

Better luck to the rest of you!

[trux]

I had similar problems, and it was discussed in this thread. Besides other, there were some helpful links from Tim1 to the DAN website (Divers Alert Network (DAN) is a non-profit medical and research organization dedicated to the safety and health of recreational scuba divers), specifically from Edward Thalmann, M.D., DAN Associate Medical Director:

http://www.diversalertnetwork.org/me...p?articleid=48
http://www.diversalertnetwork.org/me...p?articleid=49

The topic was discussed also on the French Esprit Apnea, and almond oil was recommended there. It was recommended to well cover the whole ear canal with it before each dive. I think the almond oil you can buy in pharmacies may be better (cleaner) than the one in supermarkets, but it is probably not a big difference. And olive oil should be good as well.

On the other note, this kind of ear troubles is often related to teeth problems. It turned to be true in my case too, although I had rather healthy teeth and never had any pains, just yesterday my dentist, when replacing an old filling, found a very deep caries and a devitalized nerve. It was very close to the sinus and just on the side I had the ear troubles. Quite likely it was related.

Unfortunately I already perforated my weakened tympanum when diving two weeks ago. Although the perforation is so small that even the ENT doctor did not see it, I could clearly hear the air escaping when compensating, I have to stay a month out of water Hope it will be OK for my trip to Corsica in July!

Wish you good luck with your ears, and highly recommend to get a very good check of your teeth too.

[glassfish]

Thank you all for your tips.A really good specialised doctor is hard to be found here in this part of Indonesia but now I got this special mask an also
eardrops (here naimed "otopain").Also found some natural oil-mixture,mainly
containing coconut-oi;so i hope i will do better the next few weeks while I am here on these beautifull Islands.
Terima kasieh banyak
...Axel,the glassfish

[deep thinker]

Well I guess we can learn from someone elses problems, I personally dont have the infection but I think I know now why I cant seem to equalise, thanx to Trux, the perforation of the inner ear is most likely what ive got as I can also hear air escaping when trying to equalise and also a clicking in my inner ear when I swallow or clench my jaws.

[trullalla]

[quote=spaghetti]The truth about my ear problem? Yes, I am an "orecchione", or "ricchione" (translate this, Linda!).

ah!! i always wondered where that word came from!! you enlightened me!
but i didn't know you ricchioni had this issue with ear infections...i don't dare guessing what's the cause of that...

more seriously....
glassfish,

i had the same thing happening to me last year, for a whole 6 months. i got the first infection i thailand, treated with antibiotics and drops, and felt ok until i stayed dry. once back to the sea it came back again. i put drops and in 2 days it was gone, but came back again every time i went diving. took more antibiotics, and was good until i went diving again. and on and on like this for 6 months.
the thing is that the first infection was never cured properly, but wasn't painful during the times i didn't dive. at the end when i finally got to a good doctor he said he could see a very old infection and my ear canals were totally swollen and dry. he gave me very strong antibiotics and i had to stay dry for 2 weeks, but after that it was ok.
since then, for the first month i would put olive oil drops in my ears before diving (wax production stopped with the infection, and dry ear are very susceptible to new infections; olive oil is a good option to wax, being hydrorepellent).
now i always rinse my ear after diving with a 33% distilled water, 33% alcool 70%, and 33% vinegar. this is what the ear doctor suggested me and it's working ever since (and i dive with an average of 4 times a week...)

hope that helps.

linda

[oferdegi]

Some small suggestions:
In this thread:
http://forums.deeperblue.net/showthread.php?t=65747
I found what may be an improvement on the afterdive disinfecting formula:

Originally Posted by stone_shot

I've found that a few drops of a solution of equal parts white vinegar, isopropyl alcohol (at least 70% strength) and hydrogen peroxide in each ear after a dive keeps the nasties away--and you'll never have a problem with wax buildup!!

The way it works, I guess, is that the peroxide disinfects and also dislodges any stuck debris, the alcohol is also a disinfectant, and a solvent for fatty residues, and the vinegar provides an acidic environment, good against infections, mainly fungal (fungi love warm, moist places...).

This mixture, though, may overdry the outer ear, and make it more susceptible to infection (earwax is the body's natural first line protection). Using the olive oil before the dive would help repel water. Also, the olive oil can be reinforced with a nice, fresh, juicy clove of garlic, which is a natural "antibiotic". You just soak the clove in about a glass of olive oil, in a cool, dark place. It reaches max. potency in about a month, and you can use it indefinitely, as long as it lasts. This is also good to cure outer ear infection. In this case, drip it warm into the ear (not too warm!). Same recipe is great as seasoning for antipasti, but there must be greater experts on that than me around here (Spaghetti?)

BTW, I try to keep the whole ENT area clear of infection by gargling all sorts of stuff. My favourite is a strong solution of bees' Propolis, which I gargle for the longest time and then swallow. It's an acquired taste (i.e., it tastes horrible). I think the pharynx, with all the lymph nodes around it, and being the link between nose, throat and ears, is the best and most accessible place to fight infection and help the body's immune system do its work. If I catch these things in the bud (small itch in the throat/ nose a little runny/ clogged ear) I can usually drive them away before they flare up.

Another thing I do in order to maintain pharyngial health is to induce blood flow to the area by doing lots of tongue and jaw exercises, such as twirling my toungue all around the outer 'perimeter' of the teeth, several times in each direction, trying to extend the tongue all the way and feel the gums all around (quite hard in the beginning). There are quite a few other quigong and yoga exercises for this area, and headstands do a similar job. I think Pelizzari's manual also has some exercises for the area, that also improve control and facilitate equalizing.

Sorry for carrying on...
Stay healthy & dive safely,
Ofer